Replying to LO24201 --
Dear Morty,
today I have spent considerable time to write a contribution, which
heavily relies on irreversibility of time. This means that state 1 evolves
to state 2 which evolves further to state 3. Irreversible time means that
state 3 cannot be state 1 again. I hope you don't mind if I use symbols to
depict what I mean:
state 1 --(activity 1)--> state 2 --(activity 2)--> state 3
At least for John Zavackis argument, I am quite sure that he think like:
Diagram 1:
state 1 --(learning)--> state 2 --(unlearning)--> state 3
and I agree with John, that the word 'unlearning' for the second activity
does not quite fit, because of the following association:
Diagram 2:
state 1 <--(unlearning)-- state 2
with a forbidden direction of the arrow.
Now you write:
>My experience is that it is possible to totally eliminate the "old"
>learning.
These words, as well as the word 'unlearning' sounds as if you would
seriously thinking in terms of diagram 2, but your example fits well to
diagram 1:
>For example, a person may have learned as a child that "I'm not
>good enough" as a result of his parents always being critical. We have
>worked with over 1,000 private clients who have totally "unlearned" that
>and other similar "facts" and who now believe (not just cognitively or as
>an affirmation, but experientially) that "I am good enough." The
>unlearning and new learning have lasted for many years without
>reinforcement.
Let state 2 be the state, where the clients firmly hold the belief "I am
not good enough" to be the truth. Now you go through a process with them
and arrive at a state where they believe that "I am good enough". Is this
final state a state 1 or a state 3? Do your clients remember that there
was a time in their lives, where they honestly believed (unbelievable as
it is now) that they were not good enough? If yes, they are in state 3,
you have used diagram 1 and John's argument holds.
If no, I would have some serious questions.
Liebe Gruesse,
Winfried
--"Winfried Dressler" <winfried.dressler@voith.de>
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