Replying to LO24358 --
Dear org learners
> > This is not an accurate representation of how the human mind
> > works, there is no pressure build up of any kind in the mind.
> > The human mind is more like a set of images, sounds, feelings
> > set in slides (or moving images) which is recalled by using the
> > human sensory apparatus (eyes, ears, skin, nose, taste).
>
> I have indicated by the "like" that I use the phrase "build up of
> pressure" as a metaphor. I could also have said that there is an "overload
> of raw experiences".
>
> However, the questioned which I posed, is what happens to the mind if
> there is insufficient expression of experiences -- too much (experiences)
> coming in and too little (expressions) going out. Its like asking "What
> happens to the body if too much food is eaten and too little excercise is
> done?" By now we know that a string of events will follow:- obesity,
> diabetes, heart failure, etc. But my question refers not the whole body,
> but specifically the brain-mind (material-abastract) system.
This point you make about only the brain-mind is the point I was trying to
make in another string about observing the continuous field and the
discriminated object. Your tendency is to very much the discriminated
object which I think excludes the other which creates myopic vision. A
good example of this is the vases and the face. When we look we see the
one or the other.
> You wrote:
> > The human mind is more like a set of images...... which is
> > recalled by using the human sensory apparatus .....
> Where does this "set of images" originally come from? Is this
> "set of images" something else than "experiences having been
> expressed"?
> I do not want to get in argument with
> you. I merely want you to think about things which you may
> have overlooked. Things just do not exist in our mind as blue
> pets falling on our head from the sky.
Again I do not think I have overlooked what you are saying but rather
looked from a different point of view. Off course things do not just exist
in the mind from nowhere. They come from some where. And from many
sources. From our past (that's before us, I have spoken about time
binding) from our presently evolving environment, our genetics etc etc..
We also have the ability to create in the mind that's how creation works
first in the mind then in the material world.
> You also wrote:
> >The only reason why it feels like pressure is because we
> >focus on the one sensory system that keeps bringing up
> >the same slide(s). Often this is called by therapists as not
> >being able to let go.
>
> I suspect that you focus on experiences having been experienced before. In
> that case your explanation sounds reasonable for such repeated experiences
> which had never been expressed healthy before. But what happens when being
> subjected quickly to many, diverse and new experiences so that the
> majority of them cannot become expressed constructively?
Again that is a supposition, your assumption what is happening in anothers
world. That is your perception. Again focusing on the discriminated
object. The inability of one not to express ones experiences in a healthy
fashion has nothing to do with another but that individuals inability to
express itself.
Give me an specific example. (a short one)
Most experiences are unique to that individual and one cannot assume that
one has unique experiences only. As I mentioned before no two people live
in the same time. I cannot guess at what these specific experiences are
that you talk about.
> The answer will
> be rich (and thus lenghty) once again. People all over the world are now
> having unprecedented experiences as a result of "globalisation". Perhaps
> my rich picture will give them some guidance.
>
> The answer in terms of the physical neurological system is as follows.
> Sensory inputs are relayed from one neuron to a bundel of subsequent
> neurons (one-to-many) where they "almost join", the so-called neuron
> synapses. They make effective contact with each other over a slight gap by
> the transport of low molecular mass substances called neurotransmitters
> like acetylcholine, adrenaline, dopamine and serotonin. When the
> neurotransmitters enter the subsequent neuron longitudinally, they cause a
> lateral displacement of cations (like potassium) through the wall of the
> neuron's axon. This displacement then propagates itself as a soliton wave
> along the wall of the axon to the other end of the neuron where the
> process is repeated into the next bundels of neurons. A fresh neuron can
> fire a couple of times in a second, but the rate of firing decreases
> gradually if the neuron is not allowed to "rest". How?
At, you are searching for the answer at the discriminated object but the
answer is elusive because you cannot really find it, where you are trying
to look. It is just not there.
> We may almost think of a row of dominos branching like a tree. When the
> first one at the base of the trunk topples over, it causes the toppling of
> the subsequent ones until this entire tree "in the forest" has toppled
> over. The tree cannot topple over again UNLESS its dominos are set up
> again. In other words, the neurons have to return back to their original
> state of "ready to fire". This happens with some of the neurotransmittters
> diffusing back into the previous neurons, but the majority becoming
> inactiviated (hydrolised) by special enzymes PRODUCED in the "forest" and
> not the toppled tree. These enzymes are not just there, but have to be
> produced. They are produced when the very forest begin to fire in harmony
> so as incorporate the "dissonance" of the one toppled tree into a new
> harmony. Its almost like Beethoven introducing a dissonant chord in a
> sonata of him just to resolve it gradually in a fantastic new and richer
> harmony.
>
> When the brain is subjected at a high rate with many, diverse and new
> sensory inputs (discerned as experiences), the toppled over trees become
> quickly more. The harmonius swaying of the forest cannot any more lift
> each of them upright again. Its almost as if the harmonius swaying of the
> forest is destroyed by a hurricane. Disaster in an actual forest is
> emminent -- something which will take many years to recover from.
>
> But what happens to the abstract mind and not the material brain? One of
> the first signs is a feeling of mental discomfort. Then unease with basic,
> daily practices like eating, sleeping and toilet sets in -- can I sleap
> here, is it safe to go to sleep, how will I wake up, etc. Later on almost
> imperceptable iodiosyncrasies begin to blow up into severe compulsions and
> obsessions. Eventually an irrational urge to flee from it all (suicide,
> emigration, destruction) at whatever cost sets in. The person's mental
> faculties become either frantic or sloth-like.
Oh dear me!! I think I should not comment But it sounds very poignant.
> It has happened frequently here in South Africa to members of the security
> forces and trauma units in the few years before and after the end of
> apartheid. They suddenly had to cope with too many new experiences -- post
> traumatic stress. Psychiatrists were covered over their heads with cases,
> even some of them falling aprt too. It is now happening again increasingly
> to the "new elite" (formerly suppressed people) who have to handel
> executive tasks beyond their wildest imaginations.
>
>
> humans -- underestimating the ability of humans to express their
> experiences creatively -- underestimating the necessity of humans to
> relieve themselves from experiences through expressions. When humans
> create constructively, their expressions become paradise. But when humans
> create destructively trying to portray their hurting experiences, their
> expressions become hell.
Most of your comments, At express clearly those values which drive you and
the rest of us. Our motivations are all that you say and it is
understanding that which is so critical to our ability to express
ourselves in a healthy manner. All I can say is that you are not alone,
but remember you are in a society that has many many restrictions, it uses
all the fears to bind people in a unhealthy fashion. You will recognise
what I am saying here. the use of rejection language the facial
expression of disapproval excommunication and a whole host of separation
type actions some violent
Freedom of speech and expression an American value valued so highly is
just not a value acceptable to people in South Africa. It is one of my
prized values hence I had no intention of remaining in jail (RSA) so I
left. I will give you a clue here. What is the opposite of freedom of
expression, individuality, creativity? The answer to some of your
dilemma's lie here.
I am personally free of this I did not grow up in the restrictive
Afrikaner society, but I observed it from afar. When I return to South
Africa, which is not often these days, I still find this behaviour
prevalent which is very sad. The anability to accept others values with
value.
Kindest
Gavin
--Gavin Ritz <garritz@xtra.co.nz>
Learning-org -- Hosted by Rick Karash <Richard@Karash.com> Public Dialog on Learning Organizations -- <http://www.learning-org.com>
"Learning-org" and the format of our message identifiers (LO1234, etc.) are trademarks of Richard Karash.