John Constantine wrote:
> This begs the question: What is the operational definition of learning, in
> the context of the question?
>
> And, what does "organization" mean, in the context of the question?
>
> And, would the concept that "systems drive behaviors" impact either the
> question or the response to the question?
Allow me to add my one cent thoughts on the issue.
Can organizations think?
Do organizations have a will?
Can organizations feel?
Can they act and look around?
We human beings need our physical body to interact with eachother and be
aware of ourselves. We need our brains to think, our eyes to see, our
senses to be aware and to feel. Without our body we are....... nowhere?
Do we have a non physical existance beside our vissible existance? Has
any of you ever seen a dead body learn something?
Without access to my nerves and senses, without a proper rythmical working
blood- and breathing system, without my limbs and metabolismsystem I
cann't learn. If one of these three systems fail I die! Who came up with
this ridiculous concept that learning and remebering is solely an activity
of the brains and the senses? Where does the expression 'learning by
heart' in that case come from? Just a metaphor, or is there a lot of
forgotten ancient wisdom hidden in it?
How does an organization interact? Have you ever seen an organization
being aware of itself? It cann't! At least I have never seen an
organization being aware of itself! How could it? it doesn't have brains
nor a heart! IMHO this whole discussion is leading nowhere because at one
hand people use the 'learning organization' as a METAPHOR for a living
entity. On the other hand organizations are conceptualized as abstract
constructions of mechanic processes. Some see it as a metaphor for a
living entity but use pure theoretical mind-constructions, models to
influence abstract processes.
If we want to treat organizations as Learning and therefor LIVING
organizations, we have to accept them as living entities, with a living
soul, not as a metaphor but as a FACT and treat them that way. If so, we
have to use human concepts, perceptions, idea's etc. that are in coherence
with that. IMHO most of the literature on management and organizational
issues can be trashed as a consequence of this.
We have to adjust our paradigma's on what a human being is in its essence.
Are we willing to do so, including all the consequences?
====
Dr. Steve Eskow wrote:
>Organizations aren't alive. Since they aren't alive they have none of
>the powers of living beings: they don't have intelligence, nervous
>systems...They can't learn, adapt, weep, be happy.
Tom Dell:
>If so, does an organization composed of "temps" with minimal (if any)
>loyalty have the ability to learn that's needed in a constantly changing
>environment? Can and should it develop systems to insure that the
>organization as well as its "Me, Inc." workforce learns, grows and adapts?
>"Newton, forgive me. You found the only way that, in your day, was at
>all possible for a man of the highest powers of intellect and
>creativity. The concepts that you created still dominate the way we
>think in physics, although we now know that they must be replaced by
>others further removed from the sphere of immediate experience if we
>want to try for a more profound understanding of the way things are
>interrelated." -Albert Einstein.
T.J. Elliott:
>In a more general fashion, my attempt to strengthen my 'practice' is my
>struggle with personal mastery. As one old text suggests, can I give,
>sympathize and control my self? Can I attend to what is? What we offer to
>others in companies is often just our being wrapped up in a package that
>makes it visible (and acceptable). So personal mastery is of necessity
>always with me, sometimes eluding me, often daring me.
Ben Compton:
>One of the rules I've proposed is that there be a method of creating what
>I would call a "corporate insurrection." A way for people within an
>organization to rise up, rebel, and protest the behavior of the
>organization.
Jeff Blumberg:
> We cannot expect alignment until we're all singing off the same sheet.
> I know several organisations that hold onto cultures of those that are now
> dead and buried. ...now tell me organisations are not living things, or tell
>me they don't learn...good or
> bad, doesn't matter.
??:
> Which one of the metaphors is "true," Doc? Your
> biological metaphor or my
> mechanical metaphor?
Mike Jay:
>By using language, our language to bridge gaps, explain our views and
>understand reality as we see it, we hopefully can understand that others
>have differing "right" views. The mechanical and biological fit very well
>together in my view, as do several others I've seen articulated..unorg is
>nice, but none a panacea in their own right.
Cliff Hamilton:
>The major reason many business organizations and most governmental ones
>(along with plenty of NGO's too) are having so many problems is precisely
>because they are trying to maintain structures and functions created
>around machine models and metaphors in an era that has shifted far from
>that period. Most of our governmental organizations and many business
>models were developed when life was slower-paced and change proceeded at a
>leisurely rate - in an age of mass production, mass markets and rigid
>hierarchies. Those days are past but organizational structures built in
>those times remain - and trouble follows. Yes, the founders followed
>machine models and many others have followed them in the same paradigm -
>but that age is past. Building organizations around machine models or
>trying to maintain existing ones around those outdated approaches is
>precisely what we must AVOID.
Have a great Weekend!
Winfried Deijmann
--Winfried M. Deijmann - Deijmann & Partners - Zutphen - The Netherlands Artists, Consultants and Facilitators for Organizational Learning and Action Learning Events Het Zwanevlot 37, NL 7206 CB Zutphen, The Netherlands <Winfried@universal.nl> Phone: +31-(0)575-522076
"An educated mind is useless without a focussed will and dangerous without a loving heart" (unknown source)
Learning-org -- Hosted by Rick Karash <rkarash@karash.com> Public Dialog on Learning Organizations -- <http://www.learning-org.com>